ADempiere House Burning Down?

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ADempiere House Burning Down?

Postby red1 » Fri May 13, 2011 7:53 am

Hi guys, its me the fireman :) I have posted a non-inflammatory one at Sourceforge.

Putting on fireman's helmet and turning on the tap...

Things are easier said than done. Yeah, show me the code and put the dinner on my plate ready for me to eat, but who is doing the cooking and make sure the food taste right? Since Carlos days, the situation has been the same. We thought Carlos cannot work with people been the cause that things are not moving faster of meetings having more attendance. But look at now. Are people working together and meetings attended to? Nope, i dont think so. In fact things are getting worse. Centralised ID management not maintained, commit passwords not given out, modules not reviewed for admission. But this is just a summarized version of work needed.

According to our Best Practice, code review and testing MUST be done and proper voting as to their inclusion with proper release notes whether they are alpha, beta or production ready. And that final push is after the other two been exhausted with bug fixes which will definitely happen. CORRECTION to my earlier statement. Since Carlos days, the kitchen is not burning, it is the house that is burning down.

So guys this is an emergency. Please don't just wait for the final food delivered onto your dinner plates on your dinner table but no one in the kitchen helping out except the whole house burning down. Yes i agree CC is not in the kitchen but in the parliament lobby discussing which thread to delete and how to take the URLs away. That has become politics and many of us here won't comment unless it is of some good. (Pointing the hose around).

So anyone gonna help me with the water hoses? Are you going to be part of the problem or part of the solution? Anyone? (Actually there are few exceptions such as MjMcKay and Victor Perez which i noticed committing reviews be they documentation or code).

Ok, i will forget for a moment about screaming and start. I have done own code review and Fitnesse testing on more than some of the modules mentioned above and we have to take such input below as part of the roadmap of best practice. There are personal and solicited assistance, be they direct sponsorship, advice or just bits and pieces in my private work namely from Zeeshan, Kittiu, Lek, Victor Perez, Carlos Ruiz, Low Heng Sin, Steven Sackett and others in our community.

1. Adaxa GL Suspense Accts Reconcillation: i have done merging into trunk some months back in Bangkok, gone thru its screens and let Lek of Ecosoft, Bangkok check it out and she done some subject matter review with Paul Bowden of Adaxa which seems satisfatory. The documentation from Adaxa seems complete. There are no Fitnesse testing done to auto-test it. Thus i recommend this to be alpha in trunk and more peer reviews with some auto tests ought to be made for it before it can be in beta than in production.

2. Libero Cost Engine. As i reported vigorously Cost Engine breaks previous Std Costing and must not be in trunk, However it works fine for Average Costing and thus can be a good add-on for those who wishes only Average Costing. I noted that Victor has committed new changes since i last tested and i can retest with the Fitnesse testing to confirm if he has improved the Std Costing part. That i will do at next review period. Meanwhile more peer review also welcome.

3. Libero Manufacturing. Again tested its MakeToOrder and accounting consequence seems fine. But architecture review with Low Heng Sin advised that DocumentType usage should not give IP and spawn a new DocType. This has future maintenance issue and extension hell as model architecture can get seriously confused and messed up. Thus Libero Mfg is ready as a good enough functional addon but not to be in trunk.

4. Standard Costing with Libero Mfg and Teo's Fixed Assets. I have tested that they worked fine as addons in a single instance. Thus for end-users please do beta test it and report back to me issues.

5. Fixed Assets. Ongoing and found out that many things incomplete in scripts and documentation and i am reviewing the gaps while translating the Romanian terms, creating a proper document and committing work to trunk's branch. So far there is no visible backward impact. Found out that Teo migrated from Robert Klein's approach which Low Heng Sin confirmed as better architecture such as proper use of DocType processing to ensure audit trail. When Fitnesse tests are done and worked then i will recommend this to be beta candidate in trunk.

6. Ramiro's Asset Maintenance. My next task. Cursory examination shows that the module is following best practice with whole module as Package structure and no overriding of core code seen yet. Recommend to wait for my Fitnesse tests hopefully by June.

7. OSGi. I reviewed earlier on and noted many improvements and Low Heng Sin has reported clearly on its performance and issues as well as indicated that it is not ready for production. However Carlos Ruiz has made an important milestone release that will allow it for peer testing. This is done a few days ago as iDempiere 4.0. He is now actively resolving bugs and a beta candidate would be an expected consquence. It is up to date from 360LTS thru 361 (Carlos version) with basic importDb done and life testing instance online. Recommendation: Adopt it as ADempiere 4.0 as it has the best mind (HengSin) and hands (Carlos) behind it.

My greatest thanks is to Zeeshan. He has been supporting me since last winter. With his continuing support i will work harder to review the code and make testing but most of all try to bring the community together. I know there are irreconcilable differences but i believe it is a few more good dinners away. And i prefer those dinners to be in Berlin instead of Bogota or Kuala Lumpur.

Turning tap off now. :)
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Re: ADempiere House Burning Down?

Postby PeanutBlake » Fri May 13, 2011 12:23 pm

I think ADempiere is low productive in recent years.
We have to review our strategy and organization, and make actions now.
We have to listen to our customers, listen to our community members, listen to our end users: What they want? What are they thinking about? That is critical.
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Re: ADempiere House Burning Down?

Postby globalqss » Fri May 13, 2011 1:02 pm


We thought Carlos cannot work with people been the cause that things are not moving faster of meetings having more attendance.

This is becoming an urban myth as it's being repeated by the ABC people, so I think I better clarify this one.

Next time you hear somebody telling "Carlos cannot work with people" please ask him who is he/she referring to?

When I was elected as PMC Head I felt the obligation to open doors for anybody, and that's what I did, you can read all my forums inviting everybody to participate, no distinction, no different treatment for anybody.

I sent some private invitations, most people I invited answered positively, with the prominent exception of the persons involved with ABC.

To provide clear facts in january 25 of 2010 I invited to participate in PMC via e-mail to 16 persons. From ABC I invited: Colin Rooney, Mario Calderon, Victor Perez, Paul Aviles, Moyses. Also, not by e-mail, but on IRC I invited Trifon from ABC too.

Most of those 16 answered positively, but I found curious that none of those involved on ABC affair answered, and afterwards I understood it was an established policy to undermine PMC. At the same time they were moving ABC initiative and I was actively (not passively) excluded from that.

So, this urban myth must be stopped, stating "Carlos cannot work with others" when is quite the opposite, those others refused to work with Carlos (and by the way some keep refusing, what I don't really mind).

This is unfair, you invite somebody to lunch, this person rejects, and then accuse you of not being capable of sharing lunch with anybody else.
BTW, I can provide copy of the invitation mails.

The second unfair implication of this urban myth is to promote the idea that Carlos worked alone as PMC Head, unfair with me, but specially unfair with the people that helped and worked hard at my side.

Again, next time you hear somebody claiming "Carlos cannot work with others" you can invite him to read the minutes of all the PMC Meetings we conducted, all those can be found here:

There were 46 meetings with the participation of more than 17 persons (I just counted the people that participated most).

So, I hope you can help to clarify this and dismantle this urban myth, this is propaganda work at the best style of Goebbels -> "If you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it."


Carlos Ruiz
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Re: ADempiere House Burning Down?

Postby red1 » Fri May 13, 2011 11:04 pm

PeanutBlake, who listens to our top coders? Who is more important to listen to? I put my bets on only those who really done work even though they are only two. I can bet the project survive better with them than without them. Hmm.. wana bet? I bet my whole life on it.
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Re: ADempiere House Burning Down?

Postby interopen » Sat May 14, 2011 11:20 am

Redhuan, nice to see your forum back on track, really easy to use.

About the urban myth described by Carlos, i would like to share my experience working with the PMC:

1. Carlos is very easy to work with.
2. Always give help and guidance when needed.
3. Keep all his work open, code, documentation, chats,etc...
4. Works in order to have a stable Adempiere ( the key problem for the non-initiated )
5. Not let unstable or unfinished code to get into the stable repository
6. Is always open to help newcomers.
7. Always give fast and ingenious solutions to your core-code problems.
8. Follows all code and Adempiere architecture standards.
9. Is patience and give you time to organize and commit what you can.

And the only thing he ask in return is that you do the same, as simple as that.

With his help we where able in to develop a CI-QA environment for Adempiere. When we have a similar environment and more time, we will be eager to work with him in order to have a stable Adempiere (or IDempiere).


Ivan Calderon
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Re: ADempiere House Burning Down?

Postby tspc » Sat May 14, 2011 12:31 pm

I have not been around much lately, but I have to agree completely with Ivan's observations.

Just over a year ago, some really good progress was being made in the Adempiere PMC groups. The teams worked well together in a spirit of co-operation, for the good of the project. I believe Carlos was an excellent leader in his time as PMC Head. Carlos also devoted the time and energy to be present at every group meeting that I can remember and was always encouraging others to take leadership roles and to participate in the various groups.

All meetings under Carlos' leadership were in public on IRC, with full logs posted in the wiki. Compared to now where the various leadership groups meet in private and you are lucky to see a few lines, if any, posted in the minutes on our wiki. Not a very good way to involve the community.

Hopefully, in the not too distant future, I will get more involved again,

Best Regards for now,

Tony Snook (tspc)
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Re: ADempiere House Burning Down?

Postby red1 » Sun May 15, 2011 9:43 pm

Hi Ivan Calderon and Tony Snook. It is nice to see you around here too. I know you are all busy as others but yes i remember and can see the evidence that we did have a working PMC team that meets regularly and do alot of work together to move things forward. I hope to meet Tony soon next month in Melbourne and Ivan and PeanutBlake in China.

I am personally glad myself still been in the thick of the project and able to have a chance to work with you as part of the talented people of the project, wherever you are in the world. It is more than just a project, it is quite a pleasure, in spite of the ups and downs in a steaming hot ship, it is all worth the learning and experience. Let's take things one at a time.
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