Debate - Has Compiere Become Closed? Do We Fork? How?

[StevenK]

Hello, all!

1) Wiki
I searched for a suitable Wiki during the weekend, and came up with these
http://www.wikimatrix.org/compare/MoinM ... iki+UseMod
-The MoinMoin is used by the Ubuntu people (they should know something)
-The TikiWiki is an interesting concept of a Content Management System plus Wiki (we could develop a whole portal in it)
-The UseMod is quite simple
I added Twiki as well, globalqss and yes, the phpwiki looks nice .

Here is a small intro to Wikies:
http://www.hantslug.org.uk/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?AboutWiki
and here is the video of the presentation (for those who are bored to read ) ) :
http://www.archive.org/details/Hampshir ... wtousethem

The question is, as allways, what features do we need?
All Wikies are good for up to 10.000 pages, and those that use a database can go over 100.000. A manual could use ~1.000 and the documentation another ~3.000 at most. Something like a knowledge base would need more.
And we should check on the spam protection.
So I suggest to set up a Wiki to decide which Wiki to use
Seriously, now, I like PhpWiki and MoinMoin - Any suggestions?


2) About the retstrictions in Compiere licence (language, client etc)

I don't know how these restrictions will be implemented - maybe the code would be exactly the same but you would need a support contract if you use more than one language etc - this applies to the light version, which IMO is what would be GPL'ed - correct me if I didn't get it right.


3) The community and JJ

I would welcome JJ to take part in this forum. It would be even a viable, low-cost development strategy for Compiere ERP & CRM -Get all functionality in the GPL version, and add database clustering and other large-scale enterprise features in the Compiere, Inc. supported version. And who would be better qualified to support large deployments if not Compiere, Inc. and its certified partners? This way the market of Compiere, Inc. would be the large installations with the large contracts. But, in order to get to large deployments (which are always the most sought-after contracts), you have to have experience. And partners will get experience through the low-end of the market. And everybody will promote each others work. This has always been the case. So both the community and Compiere, Inc. will win. And, with a huge user base, Compiere ERP & CRM will become something like the Ubuntu of ERP's. We should work together in this. After all, it is much better to own a small slice of a very large pie, than have the whole of a very small pie.

Regards,
StevenK

BTW, Red1, why everytime I try to login to post a reply, i get a "404" page, but if I press "back" twice and get to the forum page, it shows that I have logged in allright? Maybe the page after the required login to post messages has a problem?

[croo]

So I suggest to set up a Wiki to decide which Wiki to use Very Happy Very Happy

in order to get to large deployments (which are always the most sought-after contracts), you have to have experience

Actually, Steve, I would suggest that to get the large deployments you need to be prposed by one of the big consulatncies ... and they will always suggest those application in which they have a lot of consultancy resources ... namely the SAPs & Oracles of this world! And I don't see that changing anytime soon.

Actually, it's scary but I would think our biggest competition will be Microsoft who is buynig into the SME business market in a big way ... they bought Great Plains, Navision and a few others I can't remember right now...

colin

[vpj-cd]

Caramba, Incredible how the baazar is moving, I have a lot to read here,mean while:

I want to announce to all Adempiere folks , the Adempiere project is ready at sourceforge.net :

http://sourceforge.net/projects/adempiere/

I already add some members, please send me your sf user id to add you if you want to participate and what will the kind of participation.

I will upload today Kompiere Libero code , i am thinking in use SVN, are you agree?

Do you have any suggestion to set the SVN structure?

Regards
Victor

[red1]

Yes Victor, lead the way!

I suggest all discussions can now proceed to SourceForge.

This red1.org/forum has enuf for the week.

Many comments and advice rendered, its time to let them bear fruit.

Lets start defining the forums, and committing everyones projects as sub folders in the SVN as suggested by Victor, do others think thats ok?

Hip! Hip!

red1

[jsSolutions]

The ADempiere RoadMap recommends following the JCP for contributions so that the application does not become unmaintainable. At the bottom I have added the pertinent steps of that process.

Should we expect that these steps will be implemented from the outset of the ADempiere integration?

Due to the previous environment, a lot of work has been done by various parties according to their own specification. That means there is a lot of extant work just hungering to be added. This is a good thing. But our concern is that in our enthusiasm we not create something disjointed. While Compiere erred on the side of not adding enough, ADempiere could easily err just as badly the other way.

So what review process would we expect for the contribution of existing works? Should they go back to the JCP Initiation stage so that there is community review before inclusion? Or do we rely on the executive counsel at this early time to make such decisions. (This panel was well chosen, so I am not suggesting this is unreasonable, just posing the process question.)

In the heady days of this new project our desire is to move fast, our concern is to run over the guardrail...

Thanks for listening.

js

INITIATION: A specification targeted at the desktop/server or consumer/embedded space is initiated by community member(s) and approved for development by the responsible EC.

EARLY DRAFT: A group of experts is formed to develop a preliminary draft of the specification that both the community and the public will then review. Anyone with an Internet connection can read and comment on the draft. The expert group uses feedback from the review to revise and refine the draft.

PUBLIC DRAFT: The draft goes out again for review by the public. The expert group uses the feedback to further revise the document. At the end of this review, the EC decides if the draft should proceed. If approved by the EC, the leader of the expert group sees that the reference implementation and its associated technology compatibility kit are completed before sending the specification to the responsible EC for final approval.

MAINTENANCE: The completed specification, reference implementation, and technology compatibility kit are updated in response to ongoing requests for clarification, interpretation, enhancements, and revisions. The responsible EC can review all proposed changes to the specification and indicate which ones can be carried out immediately and which will require the specification to be revised by an expert group. Challenges to one or more tests in a specification's technology compatibility kit are ultimately decided by the responsible EC if they cannot be otherwise resolved.

[lofx]

Hi All!

my name is Oscar Bueno, from spain, and i work for an Spanish consulting firm that has been working extensively with Compiere for the last three years.
We have developed our own compiere based solution, openXpertya, that like kompiere libero, or many other solutions alike, has come to be more than a fork, as has developed its own community with more than 2000 registered users, and implementations live in Spain and soon in Argentina and other latin american countries.

We also a long time ago stablished some previous dialogue with Compiere Inc, trying to make them change their views a little bit. of course, we were small then and mere beginners, and it was unsuccesful.
I am glad to see that finally and, most important, GLOBALLY, something it is done to preserve this huge source of knowledge and initiative.
We could have also offered openXpertya as a beginning point for Adempiere, but reviewing carefully the posts a fresh start is far better.
We will be reviewing our codes (so that they do not contain any comment spanish or the like) and will start delivering code to the new project.
Also, i would like to offer the community and board our presence, help and counseling for any matter needed, and humbly require the adempiere mail, if it is judged we can be of any help or proven experience.

Thanks a lot for the effort and just let us know how we can contribute.

Best Regards,

[vpj-cd]

Hi everybody, the forums are ready in sf project, please lets move and participate there.

http://sourceforge.net/forum/?group_id=176962

Do you have any suggestion to add a forum, please let me know.

Regards
Victor

[Bluewhistler]

O.K. I am a new user searching out the facts before I dive into this thing called Compiere. What a fascinating history already. Even more fascinating is you guys and the collaborations going on around this open source project. Do you realize that even though early pioneers in the technology envisioned a lot of what is represented by this forum, the ability for people from the far reaches of the galaxy to openly join minds and direct that awesome energy to a common cause, something like what is happening here would have been inconceivable to them. I know! I have some thirty years of experience with computers, software, hardware, platforms, you name it. Great job. Fantastic job.

In regard to the forking issue. I really think-as I always have-that labels create division, division disunity. Look at the recent Intelligence[?]fiascos in our(American) government. My suggestion is this: Create a hub space where all the various groups of collaborators can post bug fixes, modules, and other pertinent solutions regardless of their affiliation. Then, invite, invite, invite. The entirety will ultimately dwarf the Compiere group and will likely force a capitulation, since very much of what Compiere needs will be found outside of its obviously floundering core of developers and partners. This removes politics from the equation altogether. It also encourages contrition on the part of those seemingly nasty folks who are simply experiencing, after the fact, some serious regrets about the original open source nature of the project and are now trying to turn in the middle of the freeway at 150 mph.

Again, I am totally fascinated. This stuff reads like a novel.

[red1]

Truly spoken.
I will remember some of your key words that is so precise on the matter...
With your consent, for my novel.

[fernando]

Hello!

I see a post in souceforge forum about ADempiere.

I improve the Kompiere version and published in www.compierebrasil.com.br/2006/index_en.php. My company works with compiere since 2003 and develop a porting using Hibernate.

Unfortunely, my hibernate version has bad perfomance. Then i decided improve the Kompiere version and translate to portuguese.

I agree opinions about Compiere Inc. model. I think that this model is very damaging to open source world.

We develop the site www.compierebrasil.com.br to create the real project open source in Brazil and i don´t know the project ADempiere before today. I think that ADempiere proposal is more correct and i have big interest in contribute for the project (development, testing, document, translate, etc).

My question is: how i can contribute first?

(I´m sorry for my english)

Regards,

Fernando
www.compierebrasil.com.br (in portuguese)
www.compierebrasil.com.br/2006/index_en.php (in english)

[globalqss]

Hi Fernando, I want to say you welcome to the project!!!
I was talking today on forums if someone knows you to invite you to join

Please feel free to speak and contribute in adempiere forums:
https://sourceforge.net/forum/?group_id=176962

Good that you worked on Hibernate, this is something that Victor wants to work on.

Regards,

Carlos Ruiz

[mutha]

Hello!

I see a post in souceforge forum about ADempiere.

I improve the Kompiere version and published in www.compierebrasil.com.br/2006/index_en.php. My company works with compiere since 2003 and develop a porting using Hibernate.

Unfortunely, my hibernate version has bad perfomance. Then i decided improve the Kompiere version and translate to portuguese.

I agree opinions about Compiere Inc. model. I think that this model is very damaging to open source world.

We develop the site www.compierebrasil.com.br to create the real project open source in Brazil and i don´t know the project ADempiere before today. I think that ADempiere proposal is more correct and i have big interest in contribute for the project (development, testing, document, translate, etc).

My question is: how i can contribute first?

(I´m sorry for my english)

Regards,

Fernando
www.compierebrasil.com.br (in portuguese)
www.compierebrasil.com.br/2006/index_en.php (in english)

Hello Fernando,

It's good to see, that you too are really interested in making Compiere ERP/CRM to be really open source.

You can join other like minded developers at http://adempiere.red1.org/ or at http://sourceforge.net/projects/adempiere.

I am currently trying to download your Compiere running on Postgre and I will go through it over the weekend.

Did you know that there is another version of Compiere running on Postgre developed by Victor Perez at http://www.e-evolution.com/ing or at http://sourceforge.net/projects/cmpcs/ you can have a look at it and maybe contribute.

Welcome aboard Fernando but Red1 will do the honours for you, he is the project Leader, I am just a foot soldier.

Have a Splendind weekend.

Regards
Mutha

[red1]

Mutha has done the honour of welcoming a deserving contributor, and that is enough, in a world where borders of space and protocol disappears - The leader can never be in the way of such a force.

"Be A Good Leader, if u cannot - then Be A Good Follower, if u cannot - then Get Out Of The Way" - one US President.

Allow me to also welcome Fernando.

highest regards,
red1

[fernando]

Hello people!

Thanks for your words. I´m very happy with participation in project.

Victor, my sourceforge user is fernandoxavier. I can contribute with development, testing and docs.

I have some experiente with hibernate. One problem is, in my opinion, performance. My version (251F) with hibernate starting in 5 minutes.

Well... i will go to the meeting now... a client interested in Compiere. Why not ADempiere?

Regards,
Fernando

[red1]

It has been more than 5 years since. Now i am here in Bogota, Colombia, home of Carlos Ruiz. Never imagined to go all the way to the other side from where I first started in my little farm.

What an Animal Farm twist it has been. From here, I made a Bogota Announcement and we just had our first weekly chat session this morning.

Until next time.

red1